
*First broadcast on July 21, 2022.
Okinawa Prefecture is a group of subtropical islands in the far south of Japan. It was previously a prosperous maritime trading state called the Ryukyu Kingdom. In the second of 2 episodes about Okinawa, we focus on the kingdom's political and cultural hub: Shuri Castle. Our guest, historian Takara Kurayoshi, talks about working on the castle's reconstruction, and shares how he felt in 2019, when a devastating fire burned it to the ground. He also tells us about the forthcoming reconstruction project.
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0m 20s
Hello, and welcome to Japanology Plus.
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0m 21s
I'm Peter Barakan.
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0m 23s
This is the second of two episodes about
Okinawa, Japan's southernmost prefecture. -
0m 28s
Our topic for today is Shuri Castle,
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0m 30s
which played a central political and
cultural role in the Ryukyu Kingdom, -
0m 35s
which is how these islands were known
before Okinawa became a part of Japan. -
0m 40s
Having been obliterated once
-
0m 43s
during the battle for Okinawa
towards the end of World War 2, -
0m 46s
the castle was then rebuilt, and went
on to become a major tourist attraction. -
0m 51s
But then, in 2019,
a terrible fire broke out. -
1m 12s
Magnificent wooden buildings
used to stand right back here. -
1m 16s
As you can see, there's absolutely
no trace of them now, -
1m 19s
although reconstruction work
is due to start shortly. -
1m 33s
Between the 15th and 19th centuries,
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1m 37s
Shuri Castle served as the royal
palace of the Ryukyu Kingdom. -
1m 44s
It was bright red,
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1m 46s
very unlike the black and white of so many
castles found in Japan in those days. -
1m 54s
Various structures surrounded a courtyard.
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1m 57s
The largest was the Seiden,
the central building. -
2m 03s
This three-story wooden structure
represented the pinnacle -
2m 07s
of Ryukyu architecture.
-
2m 12s
Shuri Castle was known for
blending Chinese and Japanese influences -
2m 17s
with an authentic Ryukyu appeal.
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2m 20s
And the Seiden clearly
showcased those characteristics. -
2m 29s
The curved roof at the front, for example,
was common in Japanese architecture. -
2m 41s
The dragon carvings and
colorful decorations, meanwhile, -
2m 45s
were inspired by China.
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2m 51s
Political discussions and official
ceremonies were held inside. -
2m 56s
Here, too, the color red
features prominently. -
3m 03s
Most spectacular of
all was the throne room, -
3m 07s
which could only be accessed
by the royal family, and a few others. -
3m 15s
It was built and decorated by
skilled artisans of the Ryukyu Kingdom. -
3m 29s
The Seiden was a distillation of Ryukyu
architectural and artistic prowess. -
3m 35s
It came to represent the kingdom itself.
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3m 43s
However, on the 31st of October, 2019,
a fire broke out. -
3m 58s
The walls of Shuri Castle made
it hard to fight the fire. -
4m 03s
In the end, it took around
11 hours to extinguish the flames. -
4m 10s
The fire originated in the Seiden,
which burned down completely. -
4m 16s
Various other important
structures were lost, -
4m 20s
and over 300 cultural assets were damaged.
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4m 24s
The fire was devastating,
and its cause remains unclear. -
4m 35s
The castle was a symbol of Okinawa, and
its loss hit the local population hard. -
5m 05s
Despite the shock of the fire,
people soon took action. -
5m 12s
There was widespread fundraising
for the castle's reconstruction. -
5m 22s
And just two months on,
the reconstruction project got underway. -
5m 30s
Our guest this time is
leading these efforts. -
5m 39s
Hello, nice to meet you.
-
5m 41s
Thank you for joining us
on the program today. -
5m 45s
Takara Kurayoshi is a historian
who specializes in the Ryukyu Kingdom. -
5m 52s
Where were you when
the fire broke out in 2019? -
5m 57s
I was at home, fast asleep.
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6m 00s
Then the phone rang.
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6m 03s
They said that Shuri Castle was on fire.
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6m 07s
From my house,
you can actually see it in the distance. -
6m 12s
So I checked, and I saw smoke and flames.
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6m 16s
“Ah,” I thought.
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6m 17s
It's really true.
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6m 19s
I'm sure everybody must
have been devastated. -
6m 23s
Well, many of my friends and colleagues
found it hard to believe. -
6m 29s
And then, truly,
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6m 31s
I don't think that the word “sadness”
even begins to cover what we felt. -
6m 40s
At any rate, we were all shocked.
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6m 42s
We didn't know what to say.
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6m 46s
What about the public?
-
6m 48s
Members of the public gathered nearby,
and looked at the blaze. -
6m 52s
On TV, they showed the crowd,
and I saw that report. -
6m 57s
People just couldn't believe
what they were seeing. -
7m 00s
Some younger onlookers burst into tears.
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7m 04s
What was the cause of the fire?
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7m 07s
Do you know?
-
7m 08s
The police and fire department
spent a long time looking into it. -
7m 14s
They tried to discover how
the fire started, but in the end, -
7m 19s
their official report said that a cause
couldn't be conclusively determined. -
7m 25s
When they looked at the Seiden,
-
7m 26s
they identified a spot on the
entrance level, in the northern corner, -
7m 31s
where some sort of electrical
fault may have caused the fire. -
7m 36s
But it was all conjecture.
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7m 38s
To this day, nobody knows for certain.
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7m 43s
But it was a wooden building,
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7m 45s
and I'm sure...
I mean, Japanese people are very thorough. -
7m 49s
I mean, people are always
considering worst-case scenarios. -
7m 53s
Surely there must have been some kind
of thought about “What if a fire occurs?” -
7m 59s
Well, fire safety measures were in place.
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8m 04s
There were smoke detectors, and so on.
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8m 07s
But the fire broke out very late at night.
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8m 10s
And at that time,
very few staff were on duty. -
8m 16s
Also, it seems to have started
in a northern corner of the building. -
8m 21s
That night, there happened
to be a very strong wind. -
8m 25s
And it was blowing north to south.
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8m 30s
The flames spread throughout
the wooden Seiden in mere moments. -
8m 36s
Drenchers and other fire-related
equipment were installed, -
8m 39s
but they could do nothing to stop it.
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8m 43s
And here's the biggest problem.
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8m 46s
Word of the emergency
was sent to the fire department. -
8m 51s
But when they arrived,
they found that all the gates were locked. -
8m 55s
And the castle is surrounded by walls.
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8m 59s
It took a long time for
the firefighters to get in. -
9m 02s
And when they did, it was too late.
-
9m 12s
Shuri Castle is thought to have
been built in the 14th century. -
9m 16s
At first, it was probably
used by a local leader. -
9m 20s
Then, when the Ryukyu Kingdom
was established in the 15th century, -
9m 24s
it became the royal palace,
and was expanded. -
9m 32s
Fire broke out on three occasions,
but each time the damage was repaired. -
9m 36s
From the late 19th century,
after the Ryukyu Kingdom came to an end, -
9m 41s
the castle was used for other purposes,
including as a school, and as a shrine. -
9m 49s
In 1945, in the closing stages
of the Second World War, -
9m 53s
US forces landed on Okinawa.
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9m 57s
The islands became a fierce battleground,
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10m 00s
with tragic consequences
for the Okinawan people. -
10m 07s
The castle, an underground military base,
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10m 10s
and the surrounding area
were all destroyed. -
10m 16s
When the war ended,
Okinawa fell under American control. -
10m 21s
Rebuilding work began.
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10m 26s
The castle site became part of the newly
established University of the Ryukyus. -
10m 43s
In 1972, 27 years of
US control came to an end. -
10m 49s
After a long period of
postwar reconstruction, -
10m 53s
Okinawa was once again part of Japan.
-
11m 00s
At around the same time, the university
decided to move to a new location, -
11m 05s
and then more people began to call
for the reconstruction of Shuri Castle. -
11m 12s
In 1986, that project did
indeed get underway. -
11m 20s
Our guest, Takara Kurayoshi,
was a key member of the team. -
11m 28s
He says that the biggest challenge was
the absence of key reference documents, -
11m 33s
which had been destroyed in the war.
-
11m 38s
Shuri Castle is symbolic
of the Ryukyu Kingdom. -
11m 43s
It's an extremely important
piece of heritage; -
11m 46s
its existence represents the history,
the culture, -
11m 49s
and the identity of these islands.
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11m 56s
That disappeared in the war,
leaving a hole in our local identity. -
12m 02s
At first, the lack of historical records
was a source of great concern. -
12m 09s
Takara searched high and low for
any information that might prove useful. -
12m 20s
After six months came an
almost miraculous discovery: -
12m 24s
a record of 18th-century repair work
on the castle's central building. -
12m 31s
The document was in the possession of
an expert on Okinawan culture in Tokyo, -
12m 37s
where it had escaped
damage during the war. -
12m 41s
When I saw the title,
it was just so exciting! -
12m 46s
This shows the front of the building.
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12m 49s
The document contained detailed records
of the ornamentation, and the coloring. -
13m 00s
It also had plans of interior sections
-
13m 03s
that previously had been
shrouded in mystery. -
13m 06s
It showed the number
of pillars and their layout, -
13m 09s
and listed the purpose of each room.
-
13m 14s
I was immediately confident
that we could do the work. -
13m 19s
That record, from 1768,
felt like a gift from the gods. -
13m 25s
I still think of it that way.
-
13m 27s
Thanks to that discovery,
we were able to rebuild. -
13m 32s
In 1989, after three years of planning,
construction work began. -
13m 42s
The central building required
more than 100 lengths of wood -
13m 45s
measuring over eight meters.
-
13m 54s
The 1768 document also contained
information on a red hue. -
14m 01s
This was applied to walls and pillars
in the reconstructed castle. -
14m 07s
The details that were faithfully recreated
included a dragon motif -
14m 12s
symbolizing the Ryukyu king.
-
14m 17s
The former throne room was also
rebuilt—in dazzling colors. -
14m 27s
At long last, Shuri Castle was reborn.
-
14m 35s
So the main building was
completed in 1992, -
14m 38s
20 years after Okinawa
reverted to Japanese control. -
14m 43s
I'm sure there must have been
a real sense of achievement. -
14m 47s
Although it took a lot of effort, I found
one aspect to be very satisfying. -
14m 53s
Think of music, or dance.
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14m 56s
They can survive a war,
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14m 59s
if there are performers to share them.
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15m 01s
But physical heritage,
like Shuri Castle, is gone forever. -
15m 06s
The reconstructed castle was opened
to the public in 1992. -
15m 12s
It was a physical representation
of Ryukyu culture. -
15m 17s
The castle complex told anyone
who saw it about the kingdom -
15m 20s
that once existed on these islands.
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15m 24s
It was visible to all.
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15m 27s
That made me especially happy.
-
15m 31s
In 2019, Takara saw the result
of his hard work go up in flames. -
15m 40s
However, preparations to construct
the castle again are now moving forward. -
15m 49s
The new project will make use of
approaches that were not adopted before. -
15m 55s
Key themes include
authenticity and safety. -
16m 03s
One example concerns fire safety.
-
16m 07s
This is the planning office where
the new Shuri Castle is being designed. -
16m 15s
Sprinklers will be added
for the first time. -
16m 26s
Previously, there were fears that
they might damage cultural properties, -
16m 30s
but now sprinklers are seen as vital.
-
16m 35s
They'll be housed within red piping,
-
16m 38s
so they'll blend in with
the color of the Seiden's interior. -
16m 47s
An integrated hydrant system
will also be installed. -
16m 55s
This system is often
used in tall buildings. -
16m 58s
It allows for water from
a fire truck or other source -
17m 01s
to be easily moved to different
parts of the structure. -
17m 08s
In 2019, the castle walls
hindered firefighting efforts, -
17m 13s
and valuable cultural assets were lost.
-
17m 16s
The features being introduced
in the new design -
17m 19s
will allow firefighting to
be carried out more smoothly. -
17m 25s
The building materials
that will be used in the project -
17m 28s
are currently being prepared.
-
17m 33s
One example is the wood used to
make the columns in the central building. -
17m 41s
Okinawa Prefecture, on its own, doesn't
have enough of the right type of timber. -
17m 50s
Last time, the timber was
brought in from nearby Taiwan. -
17m 54s
Historical records show
that Taiwanese timber -
17m 57s
was also used previously at Shuri Castle.
-
18m 04s
But this time,
Taiwanese timber was not available, -
18m 08s
and so a practical decision
was made to use similar wood -
18m 11s
from Nara Prefecture
and other locations in Japan. -
18m 19s
New ways of thinking are also
being applied to the roof tiles. -
18m 27s
Okinawan artisans created the tiles
used in the previous reconstruction -
18m 31s
after much trial and error,
-
18m 34s
and those tiles did an extremely good job.
-
18m 44s
So this time,
-
18m 45s
damaged tiles recovered after the fire are
being ground up for use in the new tiles. -
18m 51s
Also, fresh techniques, including the
introduction of a different type of clay, -
18m 56s
will improve tile durability.
-
19m 02s
The walls, meanwhile,
-
19m 04s
may feature paint with a
new touch of historical authenticity. -
19m 09s
The paint incorporates a rare pigment.
-
19m 12s
During the last reconstruction,
-
19m 14s
nobody was able to identify it, but
recently that information came to light. -
19m 20s
Mixing the pigment with lacquer
-
19m 23s
produces a hue very close to the color
used in Ryukyu times. -
19m 30s
The new Seiden is due to
be completed in 2026. -
19m 44s
Repair work is also progressing on
the artifacts damaged in the fire. -
19m 54s
The most common type
of item being repaired is lacquerware. -
19m 59s
At the time of the fire,
-
20m 00s
over 200 stored objects were exposed
to extreme heat for a long time, -
20m 06s
causing the coating to peel and crack,
and the wood itself to warp. -
20m 15s
Let's meet someone
who is working on that lacquerware. -
20m 22s
The only person in Okinawa
with the necessary skill to repair -
20m 26s
culturally important
Ryukyu lacquerware is Doi Nanako. -
20m 31s
She shows us what her work involves.
-
20m 41s
Lacquerware is carefully cleaned,
-
20m 44s
using different methods depending
on the type of dirt or blemish. -
20m 53s
In work like this, I pay attention to
one thing in particular. -
20m 58s
I must remove the dirt,
but not the history. -
21m 04s
The history...what does that mean?
-
21m 07s
Well, let's say I overdid the cleaning.
-
21m 12s
Some parts would look old,
and some parts would look new. -
21m 17s
It would lack uniformity.
-
21m 25s
Doi uses a traditional mix of wheat flour
and Japanese lacquer as an adhesive. -
21m 31s
It's one of the many techniques
she skillfully employs. -
21m 38s
However, you can't repair
items like this overnight. -
21m 44s
How long does the work take?
-
21m 47s
We just have so much lacquerware to do!
-
21m 51s
Over 200 objects are awaiting repair.
-
21m 57s
Completing them all would probably
take me around 20 to 30 years. -
22m 03s
Will you be around to see
the completion of the work? -
22m 07s
I wonder!
-
22m 10s
Hopefully I'll just about make it.
-
22m 14s
I would like more people to know about
these wonderful historical artifacts. -
22m 21s
If I repair them,
-
22m 23s
people will be able to see
the value of the objects for themselves. -
22m 29s
That's my goal.
-
22m 32s
Thanks to the hard work of many people,
-
22m 36s
Shuri Castle and the artifacts it housed
are on their way to being reborn. -
22m 44s
Are there going to be any major
differences this time from the last time? -
22m 48s
We've discovered new documentation.
-
22m 52s
And more research has been done.
-
22m 54s
Based on that, we have to
make all sorts of improvements. -
22m 58s
That work is ahead of us.
-
23m 00s
For example, what sort of things?
-
23m 02s
A very important research finding was made
at the time of the last reconstruction. -
23m 08s
It became clear from old documents that
-
23m 10s
the painting of the castle was carried
out by Ryukyu lacquerware artisans. -
23m 16s
That understanding was then applied
in the reconstruction work. -
23m 20s
But since then, research into lacquerware
techniques has progressed. -
23m 27s
For example,
when lacquering the walls and pillars, -
23m 31s
what sort of undercoat should be applied,
-
23m 33s
and how should lacquer be added on top?
-
23m 36s
How many times should that be done,
-
23m 39s
and how should the pigment be mixed in?
-
23m 43s
After that, how should
the surface coating be applied? -
23m 48s
A lot more research was done into
these detailed technical questions. -
23m 53s
And of course,
-
23m 54s
all of that knowledge
needs to be put into practice -
23m 57s
in the new reconstruction project.
-
24m 00s
Another improvement we can make
involves the color of the Seiden. -
24m 06s
Last time, documents indicated
-
24m 08s
that somewhere in the north
of Okinawa was a red pigment. -
24m 12s
But we didn't know exactly
what we were looking for. -
24m 16s
We ran out of time, and gave up.
-
24m 20s
But on this occasion we had more time.
-
24m 23s
So we set out to identify it.
-
24m 26s
A group of young researchers
conducted a thorough investigation. -
24m 30s
And they made a surprising discovery:
-
24m 33s
the red pigment comes from iron bacteria.
-
24m 38s
It can be found in a specific area.
-
24m 40s
So we collected it,
cultivated the bacteria, -
24m 43s
and applied the pigment to the same wood
used in the castle's walls and pillars. -
24m 49s
As an experiment,
we left that wood outside, -
24m 52s
so we could see how
durable the pigment was. -
24m 56s
If we can produce a steady supply, we'll
use the pigment in the reconstruction. -
25m 01s
We're clearing various hurdles.
-
25m 04s
Last time, we gave up.
-
25m 05s
But this time we may be able to apply
the same coating used in Ryukyu times. -
25m 11s
So it's going to be a much
easier job this time around? -
25m 15s
Well, an issue this time is
a lack of specialist artisans. -
25m 21s
In certain fields, we don't have access
to all the traditional techniques. -
25m 28s
At the moment,
we're working on Shuri Castle— -
25m 31s
but that's not the end of the project;
-
25m 33s
we're planning to recreate
other historic buildings too. -
25m 38s
And that will involve carpentry,
painting, carving, and so on. -
25m 44s
We'll need practitioners of
many different traditional techniques. -
25m 48s
For that to happen,
we need to start training people now. -
25m 52s
So you're really talking about
rebuilding a whole culture. -
25m 55s
We have to aim big.
-
25m 57s
And I want Shuri Castle
to be a catalyst for that. -
26m 02s
For example, you take on
young carpenters as interns. -
26m 08s
You get carpentry students involved.
-
26m 13s
Those measures are needed,
to help pass on these techniques. -
26m 18s
I hope that our work on Shuri Castle
will contribute to that. -
26m 22s
So the chances are you'll be bringing in
people from outside Okinawa as well. -
26m 27s
If there's something we're lacking,
we should bring it in from the mainland. -
26m 33s
Okinawa and the rest of Japan
should come together -
26m 36s
to preserve traditional techniques,
-
26m 38s
and raise a new generation
of craftspeople. -
26m 41s
In the old days, Ryukyu artisans
trained in China, or Japan. -
26m 47s
We should do the same now.
-
26m 49s
Technical knowledge should be
shared with surrounding regions. -
26m 53s
That's how you improve.
-
26m 58s
Takara shared one final
point that he sees as vital: -
27m 02s
opening the worksite up to
the public during the reconstruction. -
27m 09s
The castle's burned remains should be seen
by the public, in their current state. -
27m 16s
We have created a route
through the site for visitors. -
27m 20s
This makes it possible
for people to see what's happening. -
27m 25s
The timber will be brought in,
pared down, and assembled. -
27m 29s
The roof tiles will be added,
and everything will be painted. -
27m 33s
People should see it.
-
27m 35s
We want everyone to share
in the experience of -
27m 37s
bringing the castle back to life.
-
27m 41s
This time, we will make the process
of reconstruction visible. -
27m 47s
Thank you very much.