Role of the United Nations in a Divided World: Ban Ki-moon / Former UN Secretary-General

Hello and welcome to DEEPER LOOK from New York.

I'm Del Irani, it's great to have your company.

The United Nations was established in 1945, and maintaining international peace and security is one of its core pillars.

As the conflict between Russia and Ukraine worsens, the current UN Secretary-General has condemned Russia's actions.

But, efforts to go further and take a stronger stance have been difficult.

Russia is one of five permanent members of the UN Security Council, which gives it the power to veto any security resolution.

This is a challenge that's all too familiar to former UN Secretary General Ban Ki Moon, who faced similar issues during his reign, when Russia annexed Crimea in 2014.

So, what exactly is the role of the UN during times of conflict?

And what needs to be done to strength the UN's ability to solve global issues in a divided world?

Well, joining me once again to talk more about this is Ban Ki-moon.

He served as the eighth Secretary-General of the United Nations, between 2007 and 2016.

And he joins me once again.
Welcome back to the program, Ban Ki-moon.

Great to have you with us.

Thank you very much.

It's a great pleasure to have this interview with you. Thank you.

So, Mr. Ban I want to begin by asking you: what do you think of the UN's response to the crisis in Ukraine so far?

I have been engaging in this Ukrainian situation.

It is totally unacceptable that one of the superpowers, a Security Council Member State, Russia, has illegally invaded Ukraine.

This has spurred Europe's biggest security and humanitarian crisis since the Second World War.

Now, I really appreciate the many European neighboring countries, including Poland, who have been sheltering all these refugees, and also UN High Commissioner for Refugees, and the human rights, and UNICEF, and UNDP.

They are now mobilizing all their resources and manpower to help those people.

On August 16, I paid a visit to Ukraine for one day, together with former Colombian President, Nobel Peace Laureate, Juan Manuel Santos.

We were just appalled by what we had seen.

We visited Bucha and some other places.

Then these atrocities, indiscriminate atrocities committed by Russia, by the soldiers, Russian soldiers, were just totally unacceptable, and it is horrible.

Then, I was terrified by all this I had seen.

Now then, in the name of the Elders, we issued a strong statement that there should be accountability process.

And if ICC, International Criminal Court, or some other existing system cannot handle this one, then international community should establish a Special Criminal Tribunal, to handle this matter.

Do you think that the UN could be doing more?

Or that they could be playing a stronger role here, given what the Ukrainians are going through?

As a former Secretary-General, and also as incumbent to Secretary-General, while serving at the United Nations, I felt always very sorry that the United Nations was not able to deliver exactly what the people on the ground wanted.

But now, I have been hearing all the time of reform of this United Nations, and why the United Nation has not been able to deliver exactly what we should do,

in accordance with the charter provision of the United Nations.

Now, it all focuses on the Security Council, because Security Council has been divided all the time.

Then, this Russian Federation, they have been casting most number of veto powers.

And then, I think, United State also is the second largest at veto powering countries for political reasons.

The reform of the Security Council has been ongoing.

But unfortunately, the first and the only reform of the Security Council took place in 1965, when they expanded the number of Security Council Member States to 15, from 11 to 15.

But when it comes to veto power, there is no movement at all.

What I really was very much worried and concerned, was that even on humanitarian issues, that they were casting negative veto powers.

When Arab Spring happened, there were many people being killed, and many millions of people just have fled out of Syria.

At that time, United Nations really wanted to provide humanitarian assistance as much as possible, but even humanitarian pathway was blocked.

And the Russian Federation did not allow even a single truck of humanitarian goods.

That was very much terrible, which I regret very much I was not able to do any better.

So the some of the members that you're talking about, the five permanent members on the UN Security Council - US, UK, France, China, and Russia - Russia, of course,

being the aggressor in the Russian-Ukraine conflict, and has used their veto power to really block a lot of the UN Security Council resolutions.

One encouraging and interesting issue is that in April this year, the Delegation of Liechtenstein proposed what is known now as Liechtenstein Veto Initiative; it was passed unanimously by the General Assembly of the United Nations.

That was because of the frustration felt by all the General Assembly.

Those Security Council members who have cast veto power, then immediately they have to come to the General Assembly, and explain their position.

I hope this kind of a process can really awaken, awaken the veto power countries, that they should really change and reform the Security Council,

and do much better for humanitarian issues, and for the peace and security of the international community.

I know that your own personal experience, you've described yourself as "a child of war and a man of peace."

You grew up during the Korean War, when the North invaded the South.

In your book you talk about how you experienced poverty, you and your family fled your home.

As a young child, the UN was like a savior for you.

And you had the opportunity many, many years later to give back and to serve as the UN Secretary-General.

Yes, as you said, I was a child of war, but I became a man of peace, as a Secretary-General.

Therefore, my voice has always been very straight and strong.

In 1962, when I was a high school boy, I was one of the international students who met the President John F. Kennedy at the White House at that time.

It is still very inspiring to me, what he said at the time, that national boundaries do not mean much.

The political leaders are not talking to each other much.

But you, young people can talk without any such restrictions.

The question is whether you are ready to extend your helping hand.

That was really inspiring for me.

At that time, I thought that I should do for my country.

Then later, when I became a man of peace, I was honored to serve as a Secretary-General to the United Nations.

Now, I'm just urging world leaders: be a global leader, instead of a national leader.

And with passion and compassion do something good for betterment, and sustainability of this world for future generations.

You managed, as we mentioned already, you managed to get 190 countries to sign on to the Paris Climate Accord.

Even with the Sustainable Development Goals, you managed to get all the UN Member States to support this.

How do we achieve this type of collective action in today's society, in this day and age, with the divisions we're seeing around the world?

Sustainable Development Goals, as a successor vision of a Millennium Development Goals, is by far the most ambitious, and most far-reaching, and most inclusive vision the United Nations has ever presented in the history of the United Nations.

In that regard, I am proud to have been one of the leaders to prioritize this adoption of sustainable development goals.

Now, at this time, then, are we on the right path? I'm afraid to say so, no.

Because of the ongoing political conflicts, because of ongoing this...

affected by the climate phenomena, then we have not been able to achieve all this one.

Some assessment says that in the case of Asia Pacific Vision, this may be extended until 2050.

Our target is 2030.

And then they are now talking about that by 2030, it will not be able to be achieved.

Then when it comes to Africa, they are even predicting that it may go on till 2063.

This is a totally unacceptable scenario at this time.

And I hope that, even though we may be disappointed that we will not fully be able to achieve all these 17 goals, at least we should be prepared to have a successor vision.

So that this is a commitment, this is a promise of world leaders to the people of the world that there should be nobody who will suffer from abject poverty.

There should be nobody who will be dying from preventable diseases, and there should be no children who should not be able to study at least middle school level.

This a very grand vision that the United Nations has presented.

My very last question to you, Ban Ki-moon, is what role can Asian countries play in building a more effective United Nations?

I think Asia should do much more at this time.

Asia, when it comes to Asia Pacific, it comprises the most number of UN Member States.

Asian Pacific Vision represent the vanguard of global efforts to build a sustainable, secure, resilient, and prosperous global future.

We have limitless, I think, potentials.

There is... now we have China, Korea, Japan, India, I think those are four big countries in terms of population, in terms of economic potentialities, and therefore, I think we have to really work much, much harder.

And there is the ASEAN 10 countries are also very important group of countries, who are committed to work for world peace and prosperity.

At this time, since I'm coming from Korea, Korea, Japan, China are all are very important three countries, who have to work very closely, transcending all these past histories.

They should work more in a future-oriented way.

Then, we have many other 54 Asian countries - when they work together, they can really show their potentiality for sustainable development and addressing climate change, again.

So that's my sincere wish that leaders of Asia will work together for a better future of the world.

Ban Ki-moon, thank you.

Thank you so much for joining us.

Thank you very much.

Over the years, the United Nations has had to keep pace with a rapidly changing world.

As the problems facing humanity have grown, so has the work and role of the UN.

And while its work is guided by the principles outlined in the UN charter, the organization must continue to adapt and evolve, in order to meet the challenges of the future.

I'm Del Irani, thanks for your company.

I'll see you next time!